Curse

Creston · Jun 28, 2005, 05:54 PM // 17:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by stumpy

rushers are useless ... not because you may know or not know what your doing ... its the fact that now your a level 9 in a level 20 area.

Before automatically replying and spouting your gut, you need to realise what people are doing.
The MAJORITY of people who rush go to Droknar's, get their armor, then GO BACK TO BEACON'S PERCH.

So they are not level 9s in a level 20 area. They are level 9s with level 20 armor in a level 9 area.

Ergo, your argument makes no sense.

Creston

Talesin Darkbriar · Jun 28, 2005, 06:08 PM // 18:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Genos

...Anet likes putting real challanges into the game like this - lets face it, running all the way there is not an easy task.

Does paying higher level characters to "rush" you through a zone fall within the spirit or intent of the game as designed?
Is that the "challenge?"
Let me be the first to say, absolutely not.

If you can't do it and must pay others, how pray tell did these higher level folks ever do it themselves?
Here's as big a hint as I can give:

I did it with the NPCs and FOUGHT my way through.

Again, this is but another loathesome example of people wanting everything on a silver platter, and being in a huge "rush" (pun intended) to get through the game so they can "win" it.

Bah...my opinion of the Guild Wars population continues to sink daily...

Talesin

Epinephrine · Jun 28, 2005, 06:16 PM // 18:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Talesin Darkbriar

I did it with the NPCs and FOUGHT my way through.

BS.

I don't believe for a second that you took 5 level 10 (or is it 12, I forget) henchmen from Beacon's Perch and succesfully fought your way through to Droknar's. I can't even picture how quickly they'd be anihilated in Dreadnought's Drift.

Talesin Darkbriar · Jun 28, 2005, 06:21 PM // 18:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Epinephrine

BS.

I don't believe for a second that you took 5 level 10 (or is it 12, I forget) henchmen from Beacon's Perch and succesfully fought your way through to Droknar's.

Of course you wouldn't.
That would imply that it was a "challenge" and not simply a money making mechanism for "Coyotes." It defies current opinion.

Regardless, as Ripley's says, "believe it or not."

Creston · Jun 28, 2005, 06:23 PM // 18:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Talesin Darkbriar

I did it with the NPCs and FOUGHT my way through.

Again, this is but another loathesome example of people wanting everything on a silver platter, and being in a huge "rush" (pun intended) to get through the game so they can "win" it.

Bah...my opinion of the Guild Wars population continues to sink daily...

Talesin

Impossible. You wouldn't make it past the first group of wurms, if you somehow even GOT that far. They'd make mincemeat out of you.

Also, you need to stop letting this affect you so much. If you meet a lvl 10 warrior with obvious platemail, don't team with him. If you see a lvl 13 in Droknar's, don't team with him.
The beauty of guild wars is that the ONLY way your experience can get diluted is if you LET it get diluted (well, okay, or when the devs nerf the next area to combat botters somehow).
Don't let it bother you.

And actually, your argument is false. The large majority of rushers are people who already HAVE finished the game. They choose to enjoy it in a different way their 2nd / 3rd / whateverth time through. This way differs from yours, but last time I checked, your approval was not necessary to make anything valid in Guild Wars.

If someone wants to rush Droknar's, let them.

Creston

Epinephrine · Jun 28, 2005, 06:26 PM // 18:26

Hah. Challenge, yes, for a group of level 17 characters it is quite challenging. For a party of moron AI bots at level 10 or so it's virtual suicide. Record it and I'll believe it, otherwise I doubt you've ever been through. Going South to North doesn't count BTW - it's much easier with 7 lvl 20 henchmen, and the way Dreadnought's drift is set up it's a disadvantage to spawn at the north end of it.

I've been through Lornars with both a level 17 ranger and a level 19 necromancer. Fought my way both times, but doing it with lvl 10 henchmen isn't feasible.

Moskel · Jun 28, 2005, 06:34 PM // 18:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dax

The exploit is if the lowbie die and the rusher zones them through area to area. It takes no skill to die. If a lowbie can make it through without relying on the high level player just running through and rezzing them at each zone point it's not a exploit.

But I've movied on. I can help it if this thread stays alive

So are you suggesting that dead people don't zone or get credit for a mission? If you have a team member go through a vortex while somebody on the team is dead what happens? Do they get dropped from the party? Is the 'runner' unable to zone?

This has A LOT more implications than just Beacon to Forge running. Before you ask for a solution to what you feel is a problem take a step back and look at the bigger picture and broader implications of what the action will do.

Lasher Dragon · Jun 28, 2005, 06:48 PM // 18:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Talesin Darkbriar

Does paying higher level characters to "rush" you through a zone fall within the spirit or intent of the game as designed?
Is that the "challenge?"
Let me be the first to say, absolutely not.

If you can't do it and must pay others, how pray tell did these higher level folks ever do it themselves?
Here's as big a hint as I can give:

I did it with the NPCs and FOUGHT my way through.

Again, this is but another loathesome example of people wanting everything on a silver platter, and being in a huge "rush" (pun intended) to get through the game so they can "win" it.

Bah...my opinion of the Guild Wars population continues to sink daily...

Talesin

Screenshots speak louder than words - I don't buy it. Also, what is with these pompous asses and their "holier-than-thou" attitude? I have about 360 HOURS with my main, I have been EVERY secondary profession, I have done NEARLY ALL of the quests. Explain to me why I would want to go through the entire game again? And again? And yet again? If that kind of repetition is fun to you, by all means go ahead. Me, I'll take the rush.

Dax · Jun 28, 2005, 06:50 PM // 18:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Moskel

So are you suggesting that dead people don't zone or get credit for a mission? If you have a team member go through a vortex while somebody on the team is dead what happens? Do they get dropped from the party? Is the 'runner' unable to zone?

This has A LOT more implications than just Beacon to Forge running. Before you ask for a solution to what you feel is a problem take a step back and look at the bigger picture and broader implications of what the action will do.

I'm not saying it's an easy solution to fix. I am suggesting that if a character purposely dies in order for the runner to port them from zone to zone then you are exploiting the game mechanics. It's as simple as that. .

The simplest solution would to set level limits on what armor/weapons a character could equip. I guarantee that would not only put the nix on this (except for the hardcore adventurers), but would probably solve alot of other issues. But of course no one wants to do that. It's far more palatable to fix a problem by making the game easier. A good example is the bot fix- put more monsters to guard the chest, everyone complains.

If you rush through legitimately for the challenge and actually make it, the my hat is off to you.

Creston · Jun 28, 2005, 06:55 PM // 18:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dax

I'm not saying it's an easy solution to fix. I am suggesting that if a character purposely dies in order for the runner to port them from zone to zone then you are exploiting the game mechanics. It's as simple as that.

The simplest solution would to set level limits on what armor/weapons a character could equip. I guarantee that would not only put the nix on this (except for the hardcore adventurers), but would probably solve alot of other issues. But of course no one wants to do that.

If you rush through legitimately for the challenge and actually make it, the my hats are off to you.

Actually, nobody PURPOSELY dies when rushing. You do try to get as far as you can. My lvl 15 W/Mo actually managed to keep up so well with the rusher that the rest of the (dead) team was cheering ME on instead of the rusher

Eventually I died because I had to draw monsters away from the rusher while he was recharging his skills.
Had I had balanced stance I would have made it much farther, but the huge group of giants ganked me.

(I actually made it past the bottleneck group of wurms and grawl in Lornar's WITHOUT balanced stance...

)

Creston

Dax · Jun 28, 2005, 07:11 PM // 19:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Creston

Actually, nobody PURPOSELY dies when rushing. You do try to get as far as you can. My lvl 15 W/Mo actually managed to keep up so well with the rusher that the rest of the (dead) team was cheering ME on instead of the rusher

Eventually I died because I had to draw monsters away from the rusher while he was recharging his skills.
Had I had balanced stance I would have made it much farther, but the huge group of giants ganked me.

(I actually made it past the bottleneck group of wurms and grawl in Lornar's WITHOUT balanced stance...

)

Creston

Well, I guess it's all subjective. If you act as a meat shield knowing your going to die so the runner can rush through to rez you at the next zone and expect to do that through the course of the journey... well see what I'm getting at?

Hypothetically, if you were not magically whisked to the next zone by a rusher, you could you make the journey? You could use the resurection signet (as it intended, only once per person...)

Since Anet don't seem to bothered that people do it (atleast not yet) I guess its just a matter how you want to play.

Epinephrine · Jun 28, 2005, 07:35 PM // 19:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dax

Well, I guess it's all subjective. If you act as a meat shield knowing your going to die so the runner can rush through to rez you at the next zone and expect to do that through the course of the journey... well see what I'm getting at?

Hypothetically, if you were not magically whisked to the next zone by a rusher, you could you make the journey? You could use the resurection signet (as it intended, only once per person...)

Since Anet don't seem to bothered that people do it (atleast not yet) I guess its just a matter how you want to play.

You can get through the toughest explorable areas if you can kill a single enemy sometimes. After all, you get infinite resurrections at the shrine, so you could literally spawn 25 times per kill and still fight your way through an area. Is that in the spirit of the game? I don't think so - I kinda figure that you should get a limited number - maybe a reasonably high limit, but if you die 10+ times per enemy you kill that's getting excessive. In that light, yes, most decent parties can fight through an area, since it's just a matter of whether you can kill a single opponent before you expire.

Night Daftshadow · Jun 28, 2005, 08:06 PM // 20:06

in my opinion, a solution to stop these low level players that have no business rushing to Droknar's Forge is to make the armor available at Droknar's only to players that are level 20. just like some weapons have requirements on them. you must be a level 20 to purchase armor at Droknar's Forge.

i wonder why ArenaNet hasnt done something to stop this? may be they are allowing this to happen. may be it will be resolved in the upcoming big update.

AeroLion · Jun 28, 2005, 08:27 PM // 20:27

Armor levels at Droknar's won't change anything. It'll just shift people to Amnoon. And then you'll have people that pay to be rushed to the collectors in the desert.

Porkchop Sandwhiches · Jun 28, 2005, 08:33 PM // 20:33

There should be a NPC in Beacon's Perch who will just port you to Droknar for 25+k. Need a gold sink? There ya go.

stumpy · Jun 28, 2005, 08:37 PM // 20:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Creston

Before automatically replying and spouting your gut, you need to realise what people are doing.
The MAJORITY of people who rush go to Droknar's, get their armor, then GO BACK TO BEACON'S PERCH.

So they are not level 9s in a level 20 area. They are level 9s with level 20 armor in a level 9 area.

Ergo, your argument makes no sense.

Creston

Actually it was referring to another poster ... so your comments are ... ergo ... in your humble opinion ... understanding works both ways.

Epinephrine · Jun 28, 2005, 08:42 PM // 20:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Porkchop Sandwhiches

There should be a NPC in Beacon's Perch who will just port you to Droknar for 25+k. Need a gold sink? There ya go.

Lol, that might work, but it's over the cost that they charge.

If armour works the way weapons do then no biggie - set a hidden level requirement of 20 on the max stuff, 5 and 10 on the two sets in ascalon etc... that way you can wear whatever you want, but you only ge an effect based on your level. Level 10 in level 20 armour only gets AL equal to what a level 10 suit gets.

One big reason I wanted my end armour and walked the stupid passage was to be able to safely socket my runes and to use my dyes - I was tired of waiting. So I fought my way there - it only improved my AL by 9 points, but it meant that I felt comfortable putting my superior runes in, I was willing to use my dyes and so on.

Kali Ma · Jun 28, 2005, 09:26 PM // 21:26

Quote:

Actually it was referring to another poster ...

Well if mine was what yours and a couple of other harsh posts following mine were referring to, then I think my post got misinterpreted.

I'm a lvl 17 N/Mo that's gotten as far as Aurora Glade. This is my 5th character, not my first. I've invested a lot of time into learning the skills of my given character, and believe that I'm an asset to any team I join. I have no guild, and on rare ocassions get to quest with a few friends I've met through my journeys, most of who are well past ascension and the end of the game already, but still enjoy partying with me. The other night I helped a group of lvl 20s go through Lornar's to tame a bear, and it was a blast. It was during then that the suggestion I just run to Droknar's came up, and I started considering it seriously.

I'm not looking to be a lvl 9 in a lvl 20 area... I just want to get Droknar's on the map, and then return to where I was and continure playing normally. If I were run down to Droknar's today, there is no way I could purchase a set of +70 armor, let alone three sets. So I'd go back to where I was, and continue playing just fine with my +39 armor (on three armor sets, and a +55 chest piece on one) until I saved up enough to go get a set later on. I don't need +70 armor to play... I'm at Aurora Glade with +39/+55 and rarely if ever die, thank you very much. I'd just like to get it sooner than later so that the armor upgrade/cost issue I illustrated earlier is done with, and so that I can start saving my gold toward getting a sigil and a hall sometime before the end of the summer.

The point of my original post was to simply illustrate that not everyone who runs down there is a noob looking to pwn in early lvl arenas, or skip the game itself and just get to the end to level up faster. Some of us do play the game normally, and many of us have done so on more than one character already. The broad generalizations of anyone who runs down there, or has help running down there, as being noobs, cheaters and all around idiots who ruin the game for everyone else, are somewhat narrow-minded and inaccurate.

And in the end it's my game, my gold and my time... and so I'll do what I like with it.

ManadartheHealer · Jun 28, 2005, 09:27 PM // 21:27

When my R/W finishes the game, perhaps I will try to be a Droknar Runner

Kali Ma · Jun 28, 2005, 09:31 PM // 21:31

Quote:

One big reason I wanted my end armour and walked the stupid passage was to be able to safely socket my runes and to use my dyes - I was tired of waiting. So I fought my way there - it only improved my AL by 9 points, but it meant that I felt comfortable putting my superior runes in, I was willing to use my dyes and so on.

Bingo! Someone else actually gets it too...